i think web dubois should be required reading

[mimesere]

seriously.

you guys, WHY DOES THIS CONVERSATION ABOUT RACE AND REPRESENTATION HAPPEN THE SAME WAY EVERY SINGLE TIME?

I know I've been having it for 10+ years. Can we just...learn something?

Comments

[skywardprodigal.livejournal.com]

The cabal/maticiquola/deepad thing?

When cluelessness is a cultural value for the majority, dis what we get.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

Yes. I'm only catching up on the fringes of it, but mostly I just throw my hands up and sort of flail in frustration.

[cidercupcakes.livejournal.com]

OH JFC. Which fandom has discovered racism this time?

[kestrelsan.livejournal.com]

I just finished reading that whole discussion and had the exact same reaction. It's really fucking frustrating that we're still stuck on the mere acknowledgment of the issues. I don't even know where to start.

[cyprinella]

I ran across her latest post first and headdesked so hard at some of the comments.

[fox1013.livejournal.com]

I have no idea what's happening, as I haven't even caught the outermost fringes of it.

But whatever you said, I agree with you. :D?

[anonymous_sibyl]

Not knowing who is having the discussion this time, I will answer your question by saying it happens the same way every single time because no one is willing to go any further than the superficial.

Isn't it the wrong season for race discussions? Isn't that a summer thing? Don't we do gender in the winter?

[zvi-likes-tv.livejournal.com]

http://rydra-wong.livejournal.com/135873.html?style=mine

A round-up, in case you're interested. Race issues, some good mixed w/ fail, response, fairly decent response to response (w/ MASSIVE AMOUNTS OF FAIL IN COMMENTS, just skip the 1st two comment threads to Bear's second post), tertiary response

http://coffeeandink.livejournal.com/875967.html

Separate round-up, more to do with the gender-inequality in SF publishing. Much higher fail to good ratio, sadly.

[3jane.livejournal.com]

I like to believe that a few more people get educated every time? (No, I know, but without that faith, I'd be shooting TVs.)

[fox1013.livejournal.com]

I am starting to think I might have been happier if I didn't know. There was something nice in not thinking the entirety of the universe needed to be smote.

[minim_calibre]

I think it happens the same way because there is a nigh infinate supply of white people who have never learned a single thing about systemic oppression or the legacy of colonialism. Each time, you mostly get a new batch.

[zvi-likes-tv.livejournal.com]

Sorry. If it helps ... I do think things are getting better.

[fox1013.livejournal.com]

Hey, you don't need to be sorry. You're one of the people I don't want to smite.


I also kind of want to make the entire internet take a crash course in post-colonialism. Would that be wrong?

[halfacork.livejournal.com]

This is why I ignore 99.9% of the internet.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

Science fiction.

:(

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

I would be less frustrated, I think, if this exact same conversation hadn't been going on for 10 YEARS. Not only for 10 years, but for 10 years in the same community with a large number of the same people.

And I get that we have new people coming in all the time and they have to join the learning curve and whatever, but OMGWTF. It's like people missed Humanity 101: Don't Be a Jackass.

Flail.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

:D *adores*

People fail SO HARD, Amy. It's like they're asking for a raptor to the face.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

IDEK.

*flail*

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

*cuddles and hides* I miss you, miss Jane!

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

*cuddles* We should do something!

also, people on the internet are WRONG. Boo on them.

[anonymous_sibyl]

Maybe we have to keep having the same discussion until people realize it's okay to shut up and listen. *sigh*

I mentioned to someone earlier that I have to follow the This Is NOT All About Me Rule and go sit in a corner with my fist stuffed in my mouth until I can realize that my being defensive is an inappropriate and unproductive response to things. (Most things! Life lesson alert for me!)

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

That was pretty much my reaction. Also severe frownyface.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

:(

but Min, that makes me really really sad.

[halfacork.livejournal.com]

We totally should!

I am just no fun to be around though, since I am all sulk and misery about work.

[minim_calibre]

The System has some seriously wicked nasty built-in defense mechanisms.

(But each go 'round, I see new allies, too.)

[latxcvi.livejournal.com]

I know I've been having it for 10+ years. Can we just...learn something?

No. Because for some people, it's apparently more important to be upset that their cluelessness was called out than it is to think about why their cluelessness is problematic enough to be called out.

[fox1013.livejournal.com]

*gives you a raptor tied up in a bow*

[zvi-likes-tv.livejournal.com]

Not in the least.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

Ugh. People.