Is it possible to do meta about a movie that hasn't actually come out yet?

[mimesere]

Okay, let me get this out of the way first: I can already see where I'm going to be infuriated by the sketchy, sketchy racial politics of DMC. I already *am* infuriated by the sketchy, sketchy racial politics (Cannibals? SERIOUSLY, T&T? You had to go with *cannibals*? and let's not even get into Tia Dalma), but um. I got nothing, man, I'm mostly just going, "LA LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU." Because I am lame.

The thing is, Jack really *isn't* innocent in PotC:DMC, like...at all. DMC isn't a case of Jack Gets Into Trouble Because He Was Helping Elizabeth or whatever (though I maintain that regardless of the act that brought him to Norrington's notice -- the already mentioned rescuing of Elizabeth -- he chose to engage in a life of piracy and Norrington *is not wrong* to arrest him for it), DMC is a case where a) Jack makes a deal with Davy Jones in relatively good faith and reneges on it, b) when forced to follow the terms of that contract regardless, chooses to initially fulfill that contract by giving him 100 souls because Jack's freedom is more important to him than that of 100 other people which, in *any other movie* would make *Jack* the villain outright.

Like, I totally understand that the movie could frame all of this differently and that Jack's decision to search for the heart of Davy Jones could be prompted by say, guilt, but I doubt it. I really, really do. And I want to give him the benefit of the doubt because hello, I don't want to dislike Jack Sparrow, especially since I am supposed to spend DMC hoping he wins, but I'm stuck on the part where the entire plot of the movie stems from Jack being a selfish fucker. And yes, that's never been a question, but the choice to exercise the option of 100 Souls Instead of Jack's 1 Soul totally undoes all of the pirate/good man work that the first movie did to make our sympathies lie with Jack.

Also? It forces me to support Elizabeth. Rargh.

OTOH, it will be interesting to see if Lord Cutler Beckett is as unsympathetic a character as the trailer and spoilers are making him out to be because if he isn't, then hey! New character for me to be interested by! And if he is, then that will show up how awesome an antagonist Norrington was in PotC 1 (CotBP is an annoying acronym, man) and how awesome he will be in DMC and PotC 3. Yes, I have faith. Possibly not faith in T&T but at *least* faith in J-Dav who talked about the dialectic contradictions or whatever (BEST CELEBRITY BOYFRIEND EVER!) because hi, hi, if he's talking about how Norrington can be considered a "bad goodie or a good baddie," then he's *playing* Norrington that way and that is all to the awesome. Also? I love that in the book spoilers, Norrington doesn't say "I was wrong," to do whatever it was he did to get kicked out of the Navy; he says, "I lost all perspective." Love! And I love that he's the one to figure out just what it is that Jack did with Will and to tell Elizabeth. Oh, my clever naval boyfriend!

And? Apparently? Jack and Norrington are still bringing the snark.

Hmm. So, yes. I fully expect to come out of the movie firmly on Norrington's side, probably on Davy Jones' side, annoyed by Jack (blasphemy! I know! But there it is), and, irritatingly for me, at least a little bit in support of Elizabeth's actions. Will continues to be largely useless and *still* all damsel-y. I think that's it.

Comments

[galadhir.livejournal.com]

Yes, I was initially all 'what have they done to Norrington! They've made him a broken man over a stupid thing like losing his job? And how can he be wrong to chase Jack, Jack's a *pirate* - that's not obsession, that's doing his job!'... etc etc, but in comparison with what they've done with Jack - turning him into a mass murderer - I feel that Norrington got off lightly.

As for Beckett, I'd like it if he was the Norrington-type of this film, but even if he is an unscrupulous blackmailer, I'm prepared to at least be very interested in him. He seems like a good addition to the cast.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

I'm just all up in the air about everyone except for Norrington and I'm feeling very wary about Jack 'cause...dude. I like that Jack Sparrow is a selfish ass, but not an especially harmful one. If he starts selling souls for his own freedom, then he's stepped out of neutral-tinged-with-like-'cause-of-Johnny-Depp to Not-even-Johnny-Depp-can-save-him and that is sad.

[strangemuses.livejournal.com]

My take on Jack "being a selfish fucker" is that the writers are attempting to do what they did in the first movie: have Jack always appearing to do something dastardly, but also always appearing to have a backup plan percolating in his over-heated brain. That was part of his charm in the first movie: his actions were 99.9% selfish, but he never harmed any innocent person.

Be interesting to see if they can pull it off again in the next movies, or if they will end up making Jack look like a heartless bastard.

As for Norrington... I am all about the Norrington love. "Lost perspective," indeed! That is so in character for him. He has such incredibly high standards for himself, for the navy, for everything. I can easily see him crashing badly when he thinks that he has failed those ideals, but I also see him persevering and getting right back on track, more determined than ever, once he gets his 'perspective' back.

I know that in the end we are meant to cheer on Elizabeth and Will, and secondarily Jack Sparrow. I'm trying very hard to give a damn about Elizabeth or Will. From what I'm seeing, Will gets a decent and believable story arc over the next couple of films, so that's heartening. Elizabeth is... well, Elizabeth. But my primarily interest in these films remain Jack and Norrington. I'm quite cheered to know that Norrington remains such an important character in both of the next films. I just hope that the writers don't ruin Jack Sparrow for me. We'll see.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

See, I totally don't mind Jack being a selfish fucker as long as he doesn't hurt other people. But if he is actually selling souls and he *doesn't* try to think of something else, then I'm stuck with the idea that Jack's decided that 100 people are worth *less* than he is and I can't handwave that away.

But you know, spoilers could be incomplete and it's all in the acting anyway. So it will be interesting.

[strangemuses.livejournal.com]

Agreed. This would fundamentally alter the character. I am hoping that TPTB continue to hint that Jack has some sort of higher plan in mind. We'll see.

I wonder if TPTB might also be interested in 'darkening' Jack's character just a bit (this is a Disney flick after all) in order to subtly (ha) remind the audience that Elizabeth is the *real* protagonist of this story, and also that Will Turner is the movie's true 'hero.' I read an interview with the writers in some screenwriter's magazine back when the first film came out, and they were burbling on merrily about the fact that Elizabeth is the film's protagonist and it's all about her, her, her. I remember thinking that the writers clearly were smoking crack and must not have actually watched the movie, because it was clearly about Jack, Jack, Jack. In fact, reading that article just confirmed my personal belief that this movie owes its success to Johnny Depp's staggeringly strange performance and the fact that he played the character against the words on the page. I wouldn't put it past them to tar Jack's character a bit in order to emphasize the fact that we are meant to admire Elizabeth and Will. I suppose we'll find out soon enough.

[strangemuses.livejournal.com]

Also, forgot to say... Jack is supposedto be a selfish fucker! That's part of his appeal.

[norabombay.livejournal.com]

See, I keep forgetting that Will and Elizabeth are even in that film.

I'm hoping to see Norrington do good in this one...

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

I think it'd be a better film all 'round if Will and Elizabeth *weren't* in it.

[hms-dauntless.livejournal.com]

It seems the policy of T&T in POTC2 is to bring down all the characters to their worst (probably just for making them rise again in POTC3) except for Mr Turner. This (along with a lot of other things ) annoys me so much that I'm fully prepared to enjoy Lord Beckett. He's not worse than the rest of the pack, after all. And at least he retains a decent attire. *grin*

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

That's actually an interesting point, 'cause if that *is* what they're doing, then I can't judge PotC2 until I've seen 3 since they'd've been intended to complement one another.

Bother.

[hms-dauntless.livejournal.com]

My idea is that, after the self-standing unity of POTC1, T&T have developed the sequels as two mirror-like halves, a first one, where all the characters undergo a more or less traumatic change from their former self (and reach a moral/psychological nadir-phase), and a second one where, according to the film-makers themselves, the characters will be more or less restored to their initial situation. It remains to be seen how satisfactorily they've done it. But, yes, I suppose that, theorically, POTC2 cannot actually be judged without having seen POTC3 (they've been clever: they've contrived a way to send us all to the cinema watching POTC3 even if we should happen to not like POTC2 *grin*).

[wemblee.livejournal.com]

1) Where are you getting these spoilers? ("book spoilers"?) I don't actually want to read them, but my curiosity is piqued. *g*

2) OMG NORRINGTON.

3) But Jack *is* a selfish bastard! I thought that was the appeal. :D

4) Cage fight: Racial politics in POTC2 vs. racial politics in King Kong!

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

Heee. The novelization of the movie was released way early and some people bought it! Plus there are pictures and spoilery captions all over the place.

And you know, I'm okay with Jack being selfish! I'm just all...not okay with Jack being a guy who thinks peddling the souls of 100 people is an acceptable price for his freedom.

...that's a tough one! Because King Kong has the excuse of being a remake of a movie though PJ should have known better (I blame LotR for it -- men of the west, in*deed*) while PotC has...well, no excuse, really.