h8erade: faux academia edition

[mimesere]

So, I don't actually hate Virginia Woolf. She is never going to be a desert island author for me, but I don't hate her. The only reason I bring her up is because today I totally got into a brawl we had a discussion of Mrs. Dalloway in class.

It ended up being Team Yay Peter vs Me, and I mostly took the position of, "Peter is a dickhead and, IMO, a worse choice for Clarissa than Richard." But it did degenerate into, "But Clarissa and Peter were more passionate!" and me going, "More passionate does not equal BETTER," and also, "IT IS NOT A ROMANCE OMGWTF." Which argument train, happily, I got my teacher on as well.

And then I finally summed up my position with regards to the romantic, erotic, and passionate interludes of one Mrs. Clarissa Dalloway as, "Both men are dickheads though I maintain that Richard is marginally less of a dick than Peter, Clarissa is a lesbian anyway, and whatever, like Sally's a prize."

I am totallly not on board the mocking of hostessly skills or on Clarissa's life choices as it seems to me that the basic argument against them was, "But she would have been a better realized person with Peter to challenge her!" I do not buy it and I don't find myself entirely in charity with the idea that to be a whole and realized human being, one must choose against conventionality. It did not seem to me -- as was put forth by Team Yay Peter -- that Clarissa Dalloway was ditzy or frivolous. Do I think she was happy? No. But neither do I think she would have been happy with Peter (or, truthfully, Sally, though I think Sally would have lasted longer).

And anyway, Peter has no job and strikes me as being a useless ass.

...I really, really hated him, man.

ETA: also, I am totally bored and hyper and people should come talk to me on AIM (screen name = mimesere).

Comments

[hesychasm]

I suspect in my heart of hearts I'm Team Yay Peter, because I remember on my first read of Mrs. Dalloway I just sort of burst out in a surprise crying fit over her unfulfilled life and all. But you're exactly right, it's not an either/or love triangle situation; her life is her life and she deals with it in her own superhostess way. That's the POINT.

This comment brought to you by me watching the Oprah chickfest with all The Hours actresses on Youtube.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

*G* I think I would not have had the vehement reaction I did if Team Yay Peter in class didn't take it as a given that a) Clarissa was unhappy and unfulfilled *and* contributed nothing to society, b) that she would have been if she'd gone off with Peter instead, and c) that in order to be a fulfilled person, one has to embrace unfettered bohemia. They were as dismissive of everything Clarissa could and did do as Peter was and that irked me so much I just ended up arguing with them on every point.

[coffeeandink.livejournal.com]

If I were not going to bed right now, I would come chat on AIM. Curse these newfangled time zones!

I didn't think you'd be Team Yay Richard or Yay Peter or even Yay Sally. I did think you might be Yay Septimus, though.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

*snerk* You win at sussing out my character preferences!

I am very fond of Clarissa and Septimus both. Um. Everyone else was not so much with the liking.

And yes! Cursed time zones! *shakes fist at them in impotent frustration*

[buddleia.livejournal.com]

I quite like Virginia Woolf, or at least I have ever since I read Killing the Angel in the House, which should surely be the bible of the h8ter cabal. Summary in case you haven't read it: Women are not here to make men happy. We're not all your fucking mothers. And, oh yes, BITE ME.
And I entirely agree with you about Peter. Aside from anything else (like him being a dick), Clarissa's life is not made by the man she's with, she's a complicated and self-aware woman with a range of concerns. And, no, it's not a romance. Damn it, I could go on for ages. I stop now.

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

No, no, you totally should go on! Because you are awesome and I like it when you talk about things!

[buddleia.livejournal.com]

But there's the whole thing with the modernist structure that doesn't support a romantic resolution, and Clarissa's polite and rather touching fight over her daughter with the bitter religious lesbian. And poor Mrs Septimus (I can't remember her name), so loving and so scared. I think what I mean is that it's not a 'personal journey'. VW wants us to care about Clarissa Dalloway and all the people in the book, but not at the expense of judgement, and that's why I love Woolf. She's real, and I don't think she has much truck with 'rebels for the sake of it'. Sally was outrageous and Clarissa loved her, but Clarissa tried, and so she sort of won.
Actually, I think The Hours was a damn good rewriting, although there was still a kind of need to finish things and answer questions that VW just brushed away. Have you read it?
Oh, lor', I did warn you!

[mimesere.livejournal.com]

Heee. You did warn me, and I maintain that I find it charming and wonderful!

And I have not read The Hours, though I will probably give it a shot eventually.