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mimeserewhere by "kind of," I mean, "it fills me with rage such that I cannot even see straight."
Look, I get that fannishly we do ficathons for a couple reasons. Gift exchanges, remix, kinks, etc. There is a huge amount of awesome fic that came out of the![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
choc_fic characters of color ficathon and the Femslash ficathon is always awesome.
But.
You shouldn't need a ficathon to make you write about women and people of color. You shouldn't. Full stop. For me, the whole point has *always* been that there are amazingly fantastically interesting and wonderful women and characters of color *no matter what your personal character types are* and that there should be fic because they are at least as amazingly fantastically interesting and wonderful as white male characters. It shouldn't be a political statement, it should be an expression of love/interest in the characters.
I understand that these ficathons exist to drum up more fic/fannish product and that they're important and serve a function, but they shouldn't *have* to exist. Like, doesn't anyone else find it kind of hinky that these ficathons roll around and people write fic and then are like, "Well, I've done my good minority deed for the year," and then don't write any other fic?
Also, while I am on the subject? It is *great* to be talking about the problematic portrayals of women and people of color in the media. You know what would be EVEN MORE GREAT? Talking about the things that are done *right*. You want to talk about how Heroes is problematic with how they treat DL? I damn well want to hear about how awesome it is that Heroes *explicitly* took the black deadbeat dad stereotype and said, "HA HA NO." I want to hear about Heroes talked about the difficulties of an interracial marriage and how it brought up the concept of passing. I want to hear about how it is awesome that Heroes said, "Hey, you know who one of our gateway characters should be? A Japanese guy." I want to hear about how Linderman's right hand woman is Ms. Sakamoto and how Nathan's campaign manager is black. I want to hear about how it is awesome that the people of color on this show are the ones who are all, "Hey, you know what would be cool? Using our powers to HELP PEOPLE."
So tell me the interesting things. Write me fic about it. Tell me about how Teyla and Ronon are wonderful, because they are. Tell me about *Wallace*, who showed how Veronica Mars was wrong about the class divisions in Neptune. Tell me about Cristina and Bailey and Callie and Chief. Tell me about how Gunn's storyline is Angel's storyline in all the ways about what the cost of the greater good is and how you can go to the beige place and fight the good fight but WITHOUT THE MASSIVE DOUCHITUDE. Tell me about Wang and Damphousse. Tell me about Mr. X. Tell me about John Stewart GL and how it is amazingly fantastically awesome that Bruce and Diana hid out in a Middle Eastern restaurant when the aliens invaded. Tell me that. Tell me about Ben on Reaper and how he's the one who is the nice guy and who keeps bringing up the issue of free will in terms of the contract with the Devil. Tell me about Morgan and Anna on Chuck. Tell me about how fantastic Emerson is on Pushing Daisies. Hell, I don't even like Who, but tell me about Martha. Tell me the things you *like* about the people of color and the women, 'cause otherwise I'm just left wondering if you see them as interesting people or just as problems for you to fix.
Like, not to get all personal here, except for how I clearly am going to, but every time I read about Oh Noes, the Problematic Treatment of Race and Gender on TV/Comics/Movies/Etc, I just get more depressed. Not because those problems exist -- because they do and I'm not that much in denial -- but because that's *all* I see. Do you know how rare it is to see an Ode to the Awesomeness of such and such a woman/POC? Especially when it's done outside the bounds of IBARW or things like that? Do you know how depressing it is as a woman of color to almost never see anything *positive*? Thanks a bunch for making me feel like the characters that I love and find interesting are just problems to be solved. Thanks a bunch. Really.
If you want the writers on Heroes to deal with the problematic treatment of race and gender, maybe it would behoove you to also point out the things they get right. Because otherwise, I'm afraid that returning the show to the heights of last season will mean returning the show to comments like, "Oh my god, can we skip the family Sanders/Hawkins and get back to the Flying Petrelli brothers?" and "Why does the show keep focusing on Mohinder when it could be focusing on Peter?" You want more people of color and women on your media? Maybe it'd be nice to support the things that have them and that do them right *in addition to* criticizing the things that go horribly wrong.
And maybe if all you saw when you looked at DL was a black ex-con and not the dedicated father and family man that he was *clearly portrayed to be*, then it's entirely possible that the problem didn't actually lie with the writers of the show.
And now I am all irritated and must go to work and be nice to people.
Look, I get that fannishly we do ficathons for a couple reasons. Gift exchanges, remix, kinks, etc. There is a huge amount of awesome fic that came out of the
choc_fic characters of color ficathon and the Femslash ficathon is always awesome. But.
You shouldn't need a ficathon to make you write about women and people of color. You shouldn't. Full stop. For me, the whole point has *always* been that there are amazingly fantastically interesting and wonderful women and characters of color *no matter what your personal character types are* and that there should be fic because they are at least as amazingly fantastically interesting and wonderful as white male characters. It shouldn't be a political statement, it should be an expression of love/interest in the characters.
I understand that these ficathons exist to drum up more fic/fannish product and that they're important and serve a function, but they shouldn't *have* to exist. Like, doesn't anyone else find it kind of hinky that these ficathons roll around and people write fic and then are like, "Well, I've done my good minority deed for the year," and then don't write any other fic?
Also, while I am on the subject? It is *great* to be talking about the problematic portrayals of women and people of color in the media. You know what would be EVEN MORE GREAT? Talking about the things that are done *right*. You want to talk about how Heroes is problematic with how they treat DL? I damn well want to hear about how awesome it is that Heroes *explicitly* took the black deadbeat dad stereotype and said, "HA HA NO." I want to hear about Heroes talked about the difficulties of an interracial marriage and how it brought up the concept of passing. I want to hear about how it is awesome that Heroes said, "Hey, you know who one of our gateway characters should be? A Japanese guy." I want to hear about how Linderman's right hand woman is Ms. Sakamoto and how Nathan's campaign manager is black. I want to hear about how it is awesome that the people of color on this show are the ones who are all, "Hey, you know what would be cool? Using our powers to HELP PEOPLE."
So tell me the interesting things. Write me fic about it. Tell me about how Teyla and Ronon are wonderful, because they are. Tell me about *Wallace*, who showed how Veronica Mars was wrong about the class divisions in Neptune. Tell me about Cristina and Bailey and Callie and Chief. Tell me about how Gunn's storyline is Angel's storyline in all the ways about what the cost of the greater good is and how you can go to the beige place and fight the good fight but WITHOUT THE MASSIVE DOUCHITUDE. Tell me about Wang and Damphousse. Tell me about Mr. X. Tell me about John Stewart GL and how it is amazingly fantastically awesome that Bruce and Diana hid out in a Middle Eastern restaurant when the aliens invaded. Tell me that. Tell me about Ben on Reaper and how he's the one who is the nice guy and who keeps bringing up the issue of free will in terms of the contract with the Devil. Tell me about Morgan and Anna on Chuck. Tell me about how fantastic Emerson is on Pushing Daisies. Hell, I don't even like Who, but tell me about Martha. Tell me the things you *like* about the people of color and the women, 'cause otherwise I'm just left wondering if you see them as interesting people or just as problems for you to fix.
Like, not to get all personal here, except for how I clearly am going to, but every time I read about Oh Noes, the Problematic Treatment of Race and Gender on TV/Comics/Movies/Etc, I just get more depressed. Not because those problems exist -- because they do and I'm not that much in denial -- but because that's *all* I see. Do you know how rare it is to see an Ode to the Awesomeness of such and such a woman/POC? Especially when it's done outside the bounds of IBARW or things like that? Do you know how depressing it is as a woman of color to almost never see anything *positive*? Thanks a bunch for making me feel like the characters that I love and find interesting are just problems to be solved. Thanks a bunch. Really.
If you want the writers on Heroes to deal with the problematic treatment of race and gender, maybe it would behoove you to also point out the things they get right. Because otherwise, I'm afraid that returning the show to the heights of last season will mean returning the show to comments like, "Oh my god, can we skip the family Sanders/Hawkins and get back to the Flying Petrelli brothers?" and "Why does the show keep focusing on Mohinder when it could be focusing on Peter?" You want more people of color and women on your media? Maybe it'd be nice to support the things that have them and that do them right *in addition to* criticizing the things that go horribly wrong.
And maybe if all you saw when you looked at DL was a black ex-con and not the dedicated father and family man that he was *clearly portrayed to be*, then it's entirely possible that the problem didn't actually lie with the writers of the show.
And now I am all irritated and must go to work and be nice to people.
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(no subject)
Date: 2007-11-22 05:31 am (UTC)Is that really the case? Because I tend to notice the opposite -- that when I see theme-ficathons of any stripe, the people who sign up for them are inevitably the people who are already interested in the subject and do talk at length in their own journals, etc. -- they just decide to up and do it at the same time this time. I look over the names of people who sign up for the Big Gen Ficathon or the Big Femme Ficathon or the Big Threesome Exchange or the Big CoC Ficathon...and it's pretty much -- well, many people I don't know, and then the ones I do know? Are always exactly the people I'd think they would be. My little sadness about the ficathons (in amidst how awesome I think they are) is that I often fear it's just so much preaching to the choir. People who cared before think it's HEY, AWESOME, and people who didn't care before continue to ignore the subject entirely. I guess I haven't noticed much in the way of people feeling any need or desire to play fair-weather fan in that sense.
I don't know, I think...I'm not sure who you're talking to with this post. Are there really a whole lot of fans who are "negative" about race & gender issues in the media, but don't *also* spend time in squee? Again, it's not like I know everyone who's ever posted anything about race on an intimate level (far from it! I sometimes can't even wrap my mind around how big fandom seems lately...), but in general, the people I see being pissed off are the very people who have been rah-rahing for *ages* about their favorite characters/shows, and who are now just tired and pissed off because that approach -- the Accepted Fannish Approach (write your own stories! rec a lot! run a ficathon! tell us why your character is awesome!) -- doesn't seem to have a significant impact. I've watched people try the Share The Love approach for *years* -- Gunn fans and Weevil fans and Miguel Alvarez fans and Teal'c fans and Mickey fans and Deaq Hayes fans and Warrick Brown fans, and while yes! I'm all for Sharing The Love and agree that it must continue (early and often!)...it seems to keep slamming up against something else.
In the past year, people within fandom have been a hell of a lot more likely than before to say, hey, that something else? Could it be racism, maybe? I agree that it's been tough in a lot of ways on a lot of people, but where I don't at *all* agree with you is that it's coming from people who just haven't bothered or don't care enough to be supportive of their shows and characters as well as critical.
(no subject)
Date: 2007-11-23 10:00 pm (UTC)And I'm totally glad that your fannish experience is one such that you see the positives being celebrated in addition to the criticisms, but that's not my experience. It never actually has been. The people sharing the squee are always the same people as the ones producing the content and that's *fine*, but the people providing the criticisms don't...balance it and that bothers me. Like, I know there's reams and reams of criticism about the portrayals of race and gender on Heroes. What I *don't* see is the fic that says that these characters are being treated like anything but problems. So then, when I see a ficathon specifically for women and POC on Heroes, I'm left wondering *why that fic doesn't exist already*.
So no, I don't get to see the positives that make the criticisms worthwhile. Everyone talked a fantastic game about Gunn being interesting and awesome but the fic/vids/meta/art isn't there in proportion to the people talking. People can say Teyla is the awesomest all they want, but I'm not going to trust that until I see the fan product backing that up. I don't see these characters show up in McKay/Sheppard fic as being fully realized characters. I do get to hear, "Oh, Teal'c doesn't have a lot of backstory so I don't write him." Really, fandom? REALLY?
Anyway. That was beside the point. When I see a ficathon designed for the express purpose of generating fan produced content for women and POC, I am going to look at that and ask why they need a ficathon to do it and why that product doesn't already exist. Whereas if it were a ficathon where someone said, "Hey, you know what the world needs? More DL fic. We should have a DL ficathon!" then I would expect to see the same old DL fans writing fic. But that does assume that the content exists *already* and that's not the case with some of the things that I'm talking about.